Rules and the creative process

- [Interviewer] Do you have any rules for the way that you operate your creative process, the way you collaborate? And maybe you could talk us through your process for songwriting versus video creation. - [Speaker] You have so many norms that build up over three decades of working together, and so many sort of expectations. And you recognize the patterns of what works and what doesn't. And I'm sure this is common to so many of your guests and to you guys and so many of your listeners. The thing that works is always a little bit out of reach. For some reason, I always think of it like cotton candy. It's like it disappears as soon as you've tasted it. It is very real. You can look at it, you can taste it, you know it takes up space, but you can't really get your hands on it, it just kind of evaporates. And the one thing that's ever going to work is the thing that you don't know how to make a formula out of. It's right at the edge of what you're looking for. It's like it's got to hit you…