Timeline for answer to An apology to our community, and next steps by einpoklum
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46 events
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| Mar 29, 2020 at 0:20 | comment | added | Nakilon | I love to read about "they felt they couldn’t participate" all over the place on Stack Exchange after moderators have ignored all my flags and deleted my comments where I showed that I'm being stalked (by those who are interested to delete my content with no reason -- I proved it multiple times, but all proves are being deleted) during weeks and months but I didn't stop so they have muted me and then messaged (or it was automatic, does not matter) the staff so I've got an anonymous message saying that (after 10 years) I should leave the SO because I started asking tough questions. | |
| Nov 20, 2019 at 10:48 | history | bounty awarded | Mari-Lou A Слава Україні | ||
| Oct 28, 2019 at 13:21 | comment | added | Lightness Races in Orbit | @einpoklum-reinstateMonica I hope there are T-shirts, at least?! | |
| Oct 28, 2019 at 13:14 | comment | added | einpoklum | @LightnessRacesinOrbit: Welcome to the ranks of the bitter ingrates then... | |
| Oct 28, 2019 at 13:04 | comment | added | Lightness Races in Orbit | Sorry to see that my benefit of the doubt was, ultimately, proven to be misplaced. :( | |
| Oct 11, 2019 at 9:32 | comment | added | Askar Kalykov | What's interesting, it looks like this comm is still one-way comm. I can't find comment replies to this topic from officials. Although maybe it's just mine bad F3-fu. | |
| Oct 10, 2019 at 21:25 | comment | added | Maximus Minimus | Yes, this isn't a proper apology, this is corporate babble, buzzword bingo stuff. | |
| Oct 10, 2019 at 12:16 | history | edited | einpoklum | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Oct 9, 2019 at 23:06 | comment | added | Lightness Races in Orbit | @fredsbend What can I say... I'm ahead of my time. | |
| Oct 9, 2019 at 17:37 | comment | added | valiano | Nice catch... Sara Chipps also repeats the "welcoming and inclusive" mantra in the The Register report | |
| Oct 9, 2019 at 12:30 | comment | added | posdef | I agree with this answer, since I havent been much active on SE.Meta I cannot weigh in on this issue, but there is a good case to be made about this being an insincere apology, and a charade to still the crowds. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 21:26 | comment | added | J.R. means 'Just Reinstate' | This answer provides a great summary of why I didn't click the upvote button on the CTO's post. More than anything, it seems like an instance of internal coaching: Let me show Sara how to issue a public apology. So yes, the language of this apology is much, much better – but we're still not any closer to righting the wrong. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 20:53 | comment | added | einpoklum | @Mehrdad: So, they were ganging up on her in that "lounge" chatroom, then accusing her of being a CoC criminal. Nice. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 20:46 | comment | added | user541686 | @einpoklum: Also see this, which is also news to me... just when I thought this couldn't get any worse. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 20:27 | comment | added | einpoklum | @Mehrdad: How very "surprising"... | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 19:52 | comment | added | user541686 | Update: They emailed Monica. She isn't satisfied with their email. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 18:37 | comment | added | GreySage | This answer really needs more attention. It is calling out the CTO for trying to sweep all this under the rug without actually changing or fixing anything. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 18:26 | comment | added | einpoklum | @BradleyDotNET: I had another comment here, but it was mysteriously removed, so it's difficult for me to reply to your comment. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 18:16 | comment | added | BradleyDotNET | This is exactly what I thought when reading this. "We stand by everything we did, sorry it hurt you, we'll improve the messaging/timing next item." is the message being promulgated. The problem is the actual actions; the messaging and timing are totally ancillary. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 16:17 | history | edited | einpoklum | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Oct 8, 2019 at 14:31 | comment | added | Makoto | It goes to demonstrate that a different public figure will elicit different reactions. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 12:14 | comment | added | Anne Daunted GoFundMonica | "Mr. Fullerton apologized for Cellio having been hurt; and for the process of her termination as a moderator having been flawed; but he did not indicate she will be reinstated." Curiously, her name is never mentioned. For someone who followed the events, it's clear that it can only be Monica (also because he mentions a Jewish holiday and uses the pronuns "she" and "her"). Sara mentioned her actual last name to The Register to confirm it was her, yet in this "apology" published on MSE, her name is omitted. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 9:00 | comment | added | Angew is no longer proud of SO | There is one objective difference between what the apology says and what position SE held previously: they intend to run the new CoC by moderators and take their input before implementing it. Previously, the CoC changes were described to the mods, not shown to them, and from the accounts we have, it seems they (the changes) were not really expected to incorporate any mod/community feedback. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 8:53 | comment | added | Rounin |
This is right: "When you skip due process, your resultant actions should be null and void, or at least canceled." The meaningful apology begins with reinstating Monica Cellio and unambiguously and publicly retracting all unsubstantiated defamatory accusations made publicly against Monica. Then we can progress to next steps.
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| Oct 8, 2019 at 8:01 | comment | added | Magisch | I am somewhat disappointed that they haven't contacted Monica yet. That hints that they'll probably do so after finalizing the moderator removal procedure and releasing the CoC update, which is unfortunate. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 4:48 | comment | added | Mari-Lou A Слава Україні | I might just have to upvote this post and award it a 500 rep bounty if we don't have any confirmation that the Stack Exchange team kept their word regarding the first two bullet points. As for my comment in bold–now deleted–calling users not to downvote the letter of apology, I was thinking of Monica's delicate situation. She's being incredibly patient, smart and diplomatic, so I didn't want users' angry raw emotion to influence negatively the team's decision. Yes, sometimes a little sugar-coating is necessary in life, e.g. the ends justifies the means, but my patience is wearing thin. | |
| Oct 8, 2019 at 4:29 | history | edited | Mari-Lou A Слава Україні | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Oct 8, 2019 at 2:40 | comment | added | Draco18s no longer trusts SE | See also my comment. This apology might be a turn around, but there's a long road before SO.Inc will have my trust again (the community? Its people, there's good, there's bad, but I've generally never had a problem). So yes, I'm still skeptical. | |
| S Oct 8, 2019 at 2:09 | history | suggested | SOS | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Oct 8, 2019 at 1:56 | review | Suggested edits | |||
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| Oct 8, 2019 at 1:11 | history | edited | Adam LearStaffMod | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Oct 7, 2019 at 23:13 | comment | added | Lightness Races in Orbit | To be clear: timing aside, I agree with what you've said here. If the world ever needed a perfect example of how going 500% too far out of your way to pander to every possible need of the minority results in actual, real, practical hurt for the majority, this incident is it. Of course nobody will learn from it; that's not in vogue. | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 23:10 | comment | added | einpoklum | @LightnessRacesinOrbit: But there is (almost) no doubt. While the post is not phrased in a forthcoming manner, it is clear in its bottom line. Other than the mystery of what's in the new CoC - there are no questions in my reply. | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 23:08 | comment | added | Lightness Races in Orbit | Indeed - I think people are relieved to be able to stop sounding like bitter ingrates for just a moment, and have a genuine moment of human empathy. Whether history ends up showing that the post was genuine or not, I think it's good for all of us to take a moment and be nice over it. There's no need for further vindictiveness. Let's stop chewing each other's ears off, give David the benefit of the doubt for just a second, and take it from there. We want it to be a signal of positivity, so let's not ruin that from the outset by automatically being negative. | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 23:07 | comment | added | wizzwizz4 | Given context from seeing this going down over the course of months, I have to disagree with the majority of this answer. I'd love to elaborate on this, but I can't really – hopefully Stack Overflow will release a clarification at some point. | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 22:06 | comment | added | ColleenV | @einpoklum Yes. It's human nature that when you're really hoping for something, you will see anything that hints that it might happen as a positive. I have usually regretted hanging on to something too long due to nostalgia, but I think it's only fair to wait to see what steps the company will take. But, I'm not going to wait too long before I make a decision about what I'm willing to put up with in exchange for being part of the community moderate. | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 21:57 | comment | added | einpoklum | @ColleenV: But aren't you saying most people will just be content to hear some compliments and soft words regardless of the material content? :-( | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 21:56 | comment | added | ColleenV | @G_Hosa_Phat Sara made such a hash of things, folks were probably just relieved to see a more measured and thoughtful response, even if it had some issues. There are a lot of people who are very invested in SE and really want to find a way to make things work. | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 21:50 | comment | added | G_Hosa_Phat | I rather appreciate this analysis. When I first saw this and the overwhelmingly "positive" responses to the OP, I was a bit confused myself. I'm not saying the apology is completely trash, but it still feels a bit contrived. Yeah, I'm sure it was contrived to a large extent, but my point is that I'm not so sure about its overall sincerity in apologizing for a wrongdoing. This helps to crystalize some of the things I wasn't able to identify myself - possibly because of my lack of substantial connection to SE in general. | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 21:46 | comment | added | einpoklum | @MonicaCellio: I would appreciate your thoughts on this reply. I don't actually believe that there has been much progress with this post. | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 21:40 | history | edited | einpoklum | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Oct 7, 2019 at 21:34 | history | edited | einpoklum | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Oct 7, 2019 at 21:21 | comment | added | einpoklum | @JamesKPolk: TBH, I didn't need that much parsing to smell something off about the post. I gave it the once-over to look for what's actionable and went "wait, I thought he was apologizing here..." | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 21:18 | history | edited | einpoklum | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Oct 7, 2019 at 21:02 | comment | added | President James K. Polk | Yes, there needs to be more. We are left reading between the lines, parsing every sentence ad infinitum for clues, etc. Monica's and Sara's descriptions of what happened are not reconcilable, even taking misunderstandings into account. | |
| Oct 7, 2019 at 20:55 | history | answered | einpoklum | CC BY-SA 4.0 |